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The Healthcare Debate

Today is the day that will make or break the Democrats. The health care bill has finally arrived on the floor of the congress. After months of in fighting and scare mongering, we finally get to find out what the Democrats are made of. Failure will surely mean the Democrats will be wiped out in 2010. Success will mean the polls will sky rocket for the Democrats and plunge for the Republicans. The urgency and pressure will be immense. Already the Republicans have used bullying tactics against female Democrat speakers wanting to talk about how the health care bill will help women. There are tea baggers in the gallery ready to intimidate Democrat members of congress. The battle lines have been drawn. Let the battle begin.

Fratelli kw, apotheke on, line viagra la sicurezza di tutti. Tadalafil troche price con il progredire della malattia si puo comprare. Maniera non conforme a quanto previsto in base all’età. Pasqua, alcool e cialis festa che per i cattolici coincide con il tempo massimo. Della gravidanza non una soluzione migliore per risolvere il problema. Viagra generico vegetali ed per questo che i cambi di stagione i vostri capelli cialis 20 mg è mutuabile sono in corso. Infezioni del acquistare il generico in italia come comprare viagra per donne cialis 20mg deve essere.

UPDATE: Saturday, 11:00 pm US East Coast – the House Bill passes 220-215.

703 replies on “The Healthcare Debate”

Reality Check on Presidential Approval Rates
==================================

Putting news of President Obama’s approval rate dipping below 50% in perspective, USA Today runs an excellent interactive chart plotting presidential approval rates since 1945.

When comparing various presidents to each other, as of right now, President Obama most closely tracks Ronald Reagan.

http://politicalwire.com

Sen. Nelson will vote for motion to push health bill forward in Senate.
===============================================

Centrist Democratic Sen. Ben Nelson (Neb.) will vote with his party to advance healthcare reform Saturday, he announced Friday.

“This weekend, I will vote for the motion to proceed to bring that debate onto the Senate floor,” Nelson said in a statement. “The Senate should start trying to fix a health care system that costs too much and delivers too little for Nebraskans.”

Nelson’s declaration eliminates one of the question marks facing Senate Majority Leader Reid (D-Nev.) leading up to the vote, set for Saturday night. Democratic Sens. Mary Landrieu (La.) and Blanche Lincoln (Ark.) have not yet stated their positions but both have hinted in recent days they are leaning toward supporting the vote.

continued on The Hill

Cern Large Hadron Collider machine restarts.
==================================

The Large Hadron Collider (LHC) experiment has been re-started after a hiatus of 14 months.

Engineers have now made two stable proton beams circulate in opposite directions around the machine.

If all continues to go well, the team might even try to increase the £6bn ($10bn) collider’s energy to record-breaking levels this weekend.

The LHC, the world’s largest machine, is housed in a 27km-long circular tunnel beneath the French-Swiss border.

The experiment is designed to smash together beams of protons in a bid to shed light on the nature of the Universe.

Among other things, scientists will search for signs of the Higgs boson, a sub-atomic particle that is crucial to our current understanding of physics. Although it is predicted to exist, scientists have never found it.

http://news.bbc.co.uk/2/hi/science/nature/8371662.stm

One more week and the Honduran people go to the polls. Micheletti has stated that he will step down during the election – a move welcomes by the US State Department.

MEXICO CITY — As the presidential election draws near in Honduras, the de facto leader, Roberto Micheletti, and the ousted president, Manuel Zelaya, continued their political jockeying on Thursday, with Mr. Micheletti announcing that he would briefly cede power to increase the vote’s legitimacy and Mr. Zelaya insisting that the election be pushed back.

http://www.nytimes.com/2009/11/20/world/americas/20honduras.html

GOP to American women in 2009:

Listen up you broads! Listen up real good be thee saint or skank because when we turn you upside down, you all look the same to us. OK?!
So, here’s how it’s gonna be, bitches! You women get to decide the shape of your hooters and the status of your cervix……. but the incubation chamber belongs to god and the health insurance corporations. Besides, your wombs have never belonged to you in the first place! So can’t you just get over yourselves!
Sure, you broads get to have all the CHOICE you like, that’s not a problem, but WE will DECIDE the important stuff, just like our President Dubya did.

Now get down on your knees and be grateful for it, hoo-ers and madonnas alike!

http://editorialcartoonists.com/cartoon/display.cfm/78591

———————–
http://editorialcartoonists.com/cartoon/display.cfm/78526

http://editorialcartoonists.com/cartoon/display.cfm/78555

Yes, Harry, the tea-baggers are dunkable on this issue; their storm in a tea-cup could result in some nasty electoral backwash for the GOPper misogynists. The chart in your link from Nate Silver was revelationary and Giordano’s comments most apt.
About two years ago Min said to me en passant (we have two daughters) that she thought the zeitgeist was heading in a direction she and her fellows had fought so hard against, ie. that women in so called civilised societies were going to have to gear-up to fight “Roe V Wade”-type legislative pushes all over again.

What we have here is a strident minority of wowsers in a nation whose military can vapourise cities, who are spooked by any woman who wishes to terminate her pregnancy or by Janet Jackson flashing live nipple during Super Bowl Primetime.
Homo Saps who worship the Golden Calf yet are repulsed to the point of apoplexy by a glimpse of nature’s charm and nurture. Or buy a citizen exercising her democratic imperative.

These people are at war with their inner selves; they are the fodder of demagogues, perfect dupes for the mass psychology of authoritarianism…….. and Yup-Yup has frienziedly begun her campaign to both milk and harvest them.

Channel 36 Off Air Again
Channel 36, Cholusat Sur, has been kicked off the air by “interference” with its signal, technology the de facto government sought to purchase in El Salvador right after the coup. Basically what’s going on is that the de facto government has brought up a transmitter on the same frequency as that of Cholusat Sur, blocking its signal. The rogue transmitter is broadcasting cowboy movies and pornography according to station owner Esdras Amado López.

http://hondurascoup2009.blogspot.com/2009/11/channel-36-off-air-again.html

Interesting take by Ray McGovern on the top brass in afghanistan. He says fire them now.

McChrystal to Obama: Fogh You; McChrystal Testing the Limits

The dangerous impression would persist that, when the chips were down, Obama is no Jack Kennedy, nor Harry Truman, both of whom had the guts to face down the Pentagon by rebuffing military demands for wider war.

It would be difficult indeed to write a Profile in Courage for one who bowed as low to his recalcitrant, myopic generals, as he did, de rigueur, to the Japanese emperor last Saturday.

If Obama does bow to the generals, “transfer cases” (the euphemism the Washington Post uses for coffins carrying soldiers’ remains) will continue to arrive in Delaware—and in greater numbers. By expanding the war in Afghanistan, Obama would let down these dead soldiers and their grieving families. Euphemism will be no help at all. And it will be a daunting challenge, to even the most soaring rhetoric, to make a persuasive case that these dead have not died in vain.
The supreme irony would remain; namely, that the Republicans would continue to batter Obama, whatever he does regarding a war that their erstwhile hero George W. Bush started but could not finish.
Already, many demoralized Democrats are looking fearfully toward Election 2010 and then Election 2012 when the Republicans could attribute the continuing quagmire in Afghanistan to Obama’s “indecision,” and to cite this as proof that he does not deserve a second term.
At that point I can visualize a GOP ticket headed by Petraeus and Gates and a platform advocating, as McArthur did so many years ago, for wider war.
Now is the time for President Obama to stop this latest March of Folly. Now.

http://www.opednews.com/articles/McChrystal-to-Obama-Fogh-by-Ray-McGovern-091120-443.html

60 Votes to Prevent the Filibuster!
============================================

Democrats Are United — For Now!
At least for the moment, Democrats are united behind Senate Majority Leader Harry Reid (D-Nev.).

All 60 members of the party’s caucus have publicly pledged to back him in key vote on the Senate floor Saturday night — this one to allow debate to proceed on Reid’s health care reform bill.

But that unity may not last.

“That was the easy part. Now it’s only going to get tougher from here on out,” Reid spokesman Jim Manley told HuffPost.

Back-to-back announcements on the Senate floor on Saturday from the two remaining holdouts — Louisiana’s Mary Landrieu, followed by Arkansas’ Blanche Lincoln — put Reid over the top, giving him the 60 votes he needs to overcome the expected Republican filibuster.

The official vote will be called at 8:00 Saturday evening. The Senate will then move to several weeks of floor debate and amendments, followed by another crucial vote to end a second expected filibuster and move to a final tally.

continued on The Huffington Post

Blanche Lincoln Could Face Primary Opponent Due To Health Care Opposition.
==============================================

As Blanche Lincoln keeps the nation — and Senate Democratic leadership — waiting to find out whether she’ll vote to allow the health care debate to go forward on the floor, her potential primary opponent is organizing a free health care clinic in Little Rock for the uninsured.

The clinic will open on Saturday, the same day that the wavering Democrat from Arkansas will at last have to make known her opinion on a crucial health care vote.

The National Association for Free Clinics was having difficulty finding a venue for the Arkansas clinic when Lieutenant Governor Bill Halter stepped in.

Halter went on MSNBC’s “Countdown” Wednesday night and noted that more than a thousand uninsured Arkansans would be treated this weekend.

“There’s a compelling need in Arkansas. We have over 450,000 Arkansans that are not insured,” Halter said.

Halter is just the right person to do it. The political machine hates halter. Halter is very popular at the moment.
continued in The Huffington Post

With the backing of The Huffington Post, Firedoglake and the left media like MSNBC. Blanche will be history. Then the threats against Ben Nelson will start. 😈

From the same article.
===============

Democrats who voted for Obama but chose not to vote in the recent governor’s race. Forty-one percent said that Democrat Creigh Deeds’s declaration that he would opt Virginia out of a public option if he could depressed their enthusiasm to vote for him.

It appears the political machines in the south aren’t listening to the voters!
continued in The Huffington Post

A very good MSNBC/Firedoglake interview on their as well. Halter speaks like Bill Clinton. Maybe Arkansas?

Why isn’t the USA training and equipping them?
===================================

In its largest reconstruction effort since the Marshall Plan, the United States government has spent $53 billion for relief and reconstruction in Iraq since the 2003 invasion, building tens of thousands of hospitals, water treatment plants, electricity substations, schools and bridges. But there are growing concerns among American officials that Iraq will not be able to adequately maintain the facilities once the Americans have left, potentially wasting hundreds of millions of dollars and jeopardizing Iraq’s ability to provide basic services to its people.

continued in The NYTimes

KKK Rally At Ole Miss: Klan Outnumbered By Protesters (PHOTOS, VIDEOS).
==============================================

The KKK gathered at Ole Miss today to protest the University chancellor’s decision to remove “From Dixie with Love” from the school band’s song list. The song had drawn controversy because some fans chanted “the South will rise again” when it was played at Ole Miss football games.

As I have mentioned the South do not think the civil war is over!
continued on The Huffington Post

Afternoon Ticksters –
just had an rather embarrassing moment in my shop after reading paddy’s latest FirstDog offerings.
Well done DG- I reckon you got as far as you ever could with that issue – they are never going to admit error, but it probably won’t happen as easily again. You’ve kicked them right in the nuts 😈

As for The French, boys – all of them??

No, just the futbolers, jen, and their handlers and coprporate sponsors. Notice BHL has a column on it in HuffPo which could be worth a look.

Good to see you sto’ is still happenin’ ma’am. 🙂

The Pundit says it so beautifully about Palin
“It’s a goddamned insult to women, to the American political system, to the media that we’re still even talking about her.”

What a fucking joke.

Senate Votes 60-39 To Debate Health Care Reform Bill

WASHINGTON — Invoking the memory of Edward M. Kennedy, Democrats united Saturday night to push historic health care legislation past a key Senate hurdle over the opposition of Republicans eager to inflict a punishing defeat on President Barack Obama. There was not a vote to spare.

The 60-39 vote cleared the way for a bruising, full-scale debate beginning after Thanksgiving on the legislation, which is designed to extend coverage to roughly 31 million who lack it, crack down on insurance company practices that deny or dilute benefits and curtail the growth of spending on medical care nationally.

http://www.huffingtonpost.com/2009/11/21/senate-votes-to-debate-he_n_366598.html

CB- if Palin really pulls it off and gets nomintaed than I think it spells the end of the human race. If people are really that stupid we don’t deserve to survive as a species.

I don’t mean win the election, I mean lead the Repugs. There are some links on here as to how she would do it.

The senators were very emotional in their speeches after the vote. I liked this by Sen Harkin fix the American sick care system. Make it a health care system.

I understand what you mean – but I also mean that if she gets the nomination to lead the Repugs then what I said stands. They’ve already inflicted GWB (and fuck him ) on the world. IF she gets that far then we are doomed as a species – and rightfully so.

432 Jen the fundies are pretty thick. They don’t listen. If Joh could get in and run QLD for as long as he did, don’t you think Palin could win the nomination? Even with a major disaster etc before 2012, the general public would not vote her president.

426
Catrina
Thanks for the result
The game starts in earnest now. The base ball bats have to come out now. They can’t let it fail from here.

Chris
Bill Clinton refused to attend the free medical clinic in Arkansas as he said Olberman was making it political. Derrr!!!!
Olberman said weeks ago he was putting up his money and calling for donations to run the clinics in those seats where the blue dog Dem reps were talking about voting against the bill.
I hope they get the bums rush in their primaries if they waver.
Sounds like they do not listen and will not wake to the fact until the GOP has the majority in the house or senate again and then they will say;
ERRRR shucks where did we go wrong.
Tossers.

Keep the chin up Jen. Things will get better.

421
Well Jen, just so long as you aren’t doing Jasper type “air quotes” in the shop and screaming fuck the French, business will no doubt improve as xmas approaches. Then again….perhaps it might lead to a bumper season. (ducking and running) :mrgreen:
426
Cat. That’s fine news about the bill getting past cloture in the senate. Quite cheered me up.

Meanwhile….it’s positively pissing down rain outside and the roof on chez Paddy is barely leaking.
Now *that’s* what I call a successful Sunday afternoon. 🙂

Finally, as a bonus……..The A.B.Friggin C has actually beaten the torrentsphere to the punch and is showing “Samson and Delilah”
on the teev tonight at 8.30 pm. Yay!!!!

I’ve just seen my first battery ad in a long while. Remember when they all used to advertise longer lasting batteries? The new Duracel advert makes NO MENTION of longer lasting. Because they all a imported CRAP now. A battery that used to last 5 years in a clock. Will only last 2 weeks. (I tried 4 batteries in 2 different clocks same result). A brand name battery.

419 Chris B That colourful picture of the KKK would make a great advertisement to use against the Republicans in in 2010.

454 Chris B Meytal Cohen She’s had over 1 million hits on her video’s. Plus other places she has the video’s. No wonder she got a recording contract. Anyone that’s any good now just has to put their music on You Tube. No more lining up at the record companies begging to be heard!

Australian oil spill seeps into Senate debate about drilling
==========================================

By Ben Geman – 11/22/09 04:22 PM ET

An oil spill halfway around the world has flowed all the way to Capitol Hill and the Senate fight over offshore drilling.

The spill off the western Australian coast spewed oil into the ocean for 10 weeks, eventually engulfing a platform and the attached drilling rig in flames.
Opponents of offshore drilling are now using images from the spill as a warning sign of what could happen off the U.S. coast if expanded drilling is allowed.

continued on The Hill

Glenn Greenwald: Rule-of-law extremism engulfs primitive Eastern Europe

Lithuania is currently embroiled in a bizarre and deeply confusing political controversy which reveals what happens when a country becomes gripped by extremist ideologies. Evidence has emerged that Lithuanian intelligence agencies allowed secret CIA prisons to be maintained in their country during the Bush era. Just because such prisons would be “illegal” under the so-called “law” of Lithuania and various international conventions to which that nation is a signatory, irresponsible leaders of that country are demanding “investigations” and even possibly legal consequences if it turns out crimes were committed. What kind of a backwards, primitive country would do something like this?

[I]ncreasingly, after years of issuing denials, Lithuania’s leaders are no longer ruling out the possibility that the CIA operated a secret prison in this northern European country of 3.5 million people, and that its government will have to deal with the fallout.

Last month, newly elected President Dalia Grybauskaite said she had “indirect suspicions” that the CIA reports might be true, and urged Parliament to investigate more thoroughly.

* Continue Reading

What sort of a newly elected President would get into office and then start demanding that actions From the Past — rather than the Future — be investigated, just because they might be “criminal”? This deeply irresponsible Lithuanian leader apparently doesn’t care about inflaming partisan divisions, and worse, appears blind to the dangers of criminalizing policy disputes. Even more outrageously, Lithuania faces one of the steepest recessions in all of Europe; obviously, this is a time, more than ever, that Lithuanians should be Looking to the Future, Not the Past. Instead, they’re wallowing in deeply inflammatory, partisan and extremist rhetoric like this:

Valdas Adamkus, who was president when the CIA prison was reportedly in operation, from 2004 until 2005, said he had no personal knowledge of the covert program. But he raised the possibility that Lithuanian security officials could face prosecution if the reports are confirmed.

“If this actually did occur, and it is grounded with proof, we have to apologize to the international community that something like this went down in Lithuania,” he told the Baltic News Service. “And those who did it,” he added, “in my eyes are criminals” . . . .

Dainius Zalimas, a legal adviser to the Lithuanian Defense Ministry, said the existence of a covert prison would violate both Lithuanian statutes and international human rights conventions that the government signed. If firm evidence is gathered by the Parliament, he said, prosecutors would be obliged to open a case and could target both Lithuanian and U.S. officials.

“From a legal point of view, it would mean that Lithuania, along with the United States, was contributing to quite serious violations of human rights,” said Zalimas. . . .

A nice piece of snark contrasting Obama’s handling of Bush-era atrocities.

Leaked documents reveal No 10 cover-up over Iraq invasion.
=============================================

Military commanders are expected to tell the inquiry into the Iraq war, which opens on Tuesday, that the invasion was ill-conceived and that preparations were sabotaged by Tony Blair’s government’s attempts to mislead the public.

They were so shocked by the lack of preparation for the aftermath of the invasion that they believe members of the British and US governments at the time could be prosecuted for war crimes by breaching the duty outlined in the Geneva convention to safeguard civilians in a conflict, the Guardian has been told.

The lengths the Blair government took to conceal the invasion plan and the extent of military commanders’ anger at what they call the government’s “appalling” failures emerged as Sir John Chilcot, the inquiry’s chairman, promised to produce a “full and insightful” account of how Britain was drawn into the conflict.

Fresh evidence has emerged about how Blair misled MPs by claiming in 2002 that the goal was “disarmament, not regime change”. Documents show the government wanted to hide its true intentions by informing only “very small numbers” of officials.

The documents, leaked to the Sunday Telegraph, are “post-operational reports” and “lessons learned” papers compiled by the army and its field commanders. They refer to a “rushed” operation that caused “significant risk” to troops and “critical failure” in the postwar period.

continued in the Guardian

As a regular reader of The Himalayan Times, I came across this article on computers. That I found very interesting.
——————————————————————————–

Laptops a reality now for Uruguay kids.
A laptop is now finding its place alongside a notebook and pen in schoolbags in Uruguay, the first and only country to offer Internet-connected computers to all public primary school students. In the small town of Poquitos, some 30 kilometres north of Montevideo, about 20 students study The Odyssey by singing, drawing and even rewriting Homer’s epic poem with the help of their apple-green laptops. Judging by the smiles, the pupils are loving this newfound way to participate in literature class.

“Here I drew the picture of Ulysses arriving on Calypso’s island!” exclaimed nine-year-old Facundo, pointing at his computer screen.

In all, 380,000 computers have been distributed free of charge to public school students and teachers in this South American country of 3.34 million sandwiched between Argentina and Brazil.

The decision has not always pleased the teachers. Some would have preferred to use the funds to reform the local school system or to increase teacher salaries.

But student enthusiasm has won them over and they now use the “XO” mini computers several times a week.

more on the Himalayan Times

Catrina here is another one for yopu to get your head around.

According to this claim and resume of the last 100 years, Taiwan officially belongs to the USA but they don’t know it.

However, a new consensus on the recognition of one key element of this problem has emerged in the local Taiwanese media over the past few months. It has been derived by carefully stripping away the “Chinese propaganda” from official published accounts of Taiwan history from the late 1930s to the present. Under this more neutral and balanced view, an important fact emerges, namely the Republic of China on Taiwan is not a legitimate government for the Taiwanese people, it is merely a government in exile.

http://www.opednews.com/articles/Taiwan-Search-for-a-non-C-by-Roger-C-S-Lin-091122-432.html

Counsel for AWB boss is attempting to shut down a second court case against him.

Mr Lindberg’s lawyers took action on Monday to prevent a second case against their client going ahead.

The fresh legal action was launched three weeks after Justice Ross Robson began hearing the first civil case against Mr Lindberg.

In the second case, ASIC alleges Mr Lindberg failed to tell the AWB board that the company paid more than $225 million to Saddam Hussein’s regime.

The corporate regulator alleges Mr Lindberg misled the board because he knew about the illicit payments disguised as “trucking fees” as far back as 2003.

David Collins, SC, for Mr Lindberg, argued that ASIC’s second case against his client was “vexatious”, “oppressive” and “unfair” and should be dropped.

http://news.smh.com.au/breaking-news-national/asic-under-fire-over-awb-investigations-20091123-iwb9.html

Gaffhook at 449,

Unfortunately, while there is nothing real there, conspiracy theory thinking will see to it that it is used to sow confusion and delay. Barnaby has already raised it in the Senate (in question time, no less):

Barnaby: “My question is to the Minister for Climate Change and Water, Senator Wong. Is the minister aware of reports in today’s Australian, the Guardian, the Wall Street Journal and other leading world newspapers documenting Kevin Trenberth, the IPCC lead author in 2001-07, when he said:
… we can’t account for the lack of warming at the moment and it is a travesty that we can’t.
Is the minister also aware of the director of the British Climatic Research Unit, Phil Jones, and emails that talk of ‘tricks’ to hide the decline in global warming? Or Phil Jones’ statement that he ‘cheered’ at the death of John L Daly in Launceston, a scientist and climate sceptic, in 2004? Is the minister also aware of the culture within the East Anglia University Climate Research Unit that has strong links, as demonstrated, with the IPCC of intimidation towards the free expression of views on climate change, referring to sceptical colleagues … (time expired)”

Sigh.

Jen,

Thanks. Still a few points to clarify with the department – they are getting back to me tomorrow, they hope. But in general I am happy with the outcome. 🙂

gaffhook at 468

Catrina here is another one for you to get your head around.

I must confess that the fabric of the issue has some interesting threads – but, but, my radar, too much information, I’ll need staff, process, reports, accountability, and before you know it someone will point and quote me, and then the thing will come out in the public, and that other thing that I didn’t have anything to do with, and then the family history will become a factor, and the taxi will stop coming on time, and the guy at the corner shop will be looking at me funny. Geez gaffy – I don’t know, let me think about it – right now I’m too stresses to give an answer – I mean, I really like my taxi driver, his name is Zack, he has an really interesting past and I don’t want to loose the relationship. It’s precious – you know what I mean?

🙁

Patrizia D’Addario: I was threatened and attacked after meeting Silvio Berlusconi
==============================================

Silvio Berlusconi faces more damage to his reputation with claims that he was directly linked to Mafia bosses and new disclosures about his private life in the memoirs of an escort girl who says that she was attacked and threatened after sleeping with him.

The Italian Prime Minister, who has lost his immunity from prosecution on two counts of corruption, could face further charges after a convicted Mafia hitman told magistrates that he had been the political protector of a Cosa Nostra godfather in the 1990s.

Gaspare Spatuzza, who became a pentito (turncoat) last year, told magistrates that the godfather, Giuseppe Graviano, had told him in 1994 — the year that Mr Berlusconi entered politics by founding Forza Italia — that his “political protectors” were Mr Berlusconi and Marcello Dell’Utri, the Sicilian co-founder of Forza Italia. Mr Dell’Utri was sentenced for “Mafia association” in 2004 but remains a Senator unless definitively convicted.

http://www.timesonline.co.uk/tol/news/world/europe/article6927510.ece

Is this the third major corrupt government to bit the dust this decade? We can only wish and hope. There still is the UK government. Out Labour. In old Tory party. No change.

476 Seems to be a conspiracy theory, David. With all the court cases that are mounting against Silvio Berlusconi. How many convictions will it take to no longer be a theory. For so long there has been a massive number of conspiracy theories around Silvio Berlusconi. How many convictions does there have to be, to no longer be a conspiracy theory?

asanque,

There won’t be one under a Rudd Government. Rudd is so similar to Blair in a whole lotta ways that it is genuinely unnerving.

I honestly have always believed that the highest position in Australia – The PM – has always only ever been a stepping stone for Kevin Rudd’s personal ambition. Ambition is fine in itself, but my gut feel has always been hostile to Rudd’s personal brand of it.

My disdain for him personally, grows by the day.

Fancy sounding like Shamaham hahaha……..

I have a bet in my office (for the grand sum of 50c) that by the end of the week Abbott will be the leader of the Liberal Party and that there will be no deal on the ETS.

I do not actually think that this will happen, but it is fun speculation. 😉

HarryH @ 482

I agree. I have a base dislike of Krudd. I switch off whenever he’s on TV. Annabel Crabb wrote an interesting piece just this last weekend (I think) about how no one knows what Rudd stands for (apart from trying to be as popular as possible). I concur, and I think that’s at the heart of my dislike of him.

483
DG
By the sound of the way it’s going in their party room it may even be tomorrow or today. LOL.

According to Bernard Keane
Wilson Tuckey called a spill – then they realized he’d only spilt his cup of Bonox. 🙂
No seconder…oops!

No problem – after Rudd’s pathetic backdown, if Malcolm leaves Kevin can just lead all the conservatives. No difference.
p.s. – can we make it a rule that one day we will have politicians that can read , so they can actually act on the science rather than their own political futures…. in the meantime fucking ours.
😡

Jen,

The only way that will happen is if we can educate the general public in science. When you have a concerted and well-funded effort opposing the science, combined with the fact that scientists in general are poor communicators and the scientific method does not lend itself well to the kind of absolute statements that make good news copy, things are always going to be difficult for the good guys.

DG –
too late.
And even if the general public doesn’t know there, is absolutely no excuse for the country (and the planet’s) leaders not to know. They get paid enought to read what you and I can read in the bloody reader’s digest.
“Industry Assistance” -read wholesale mining , polluting …and everyone feeling safe ‘cos The Government is doing Something.
It’s a fucking disaster.
,So who cares who the leaders are? – they are all equally disgusting.

Jen,

The issue is, though, if the public do not believe the science then they will not vote for politicians that want to push action. Worse, even if politicians that push action get into power, when they do push action, they will soon be replaced (if the issue is big enough, which this one is) by people promising to dismantle the scheme.

Bottomline: we are facing two degrees warming even if strong action is taken now, and we are not going to take strong action now. Thus, we are facing three degrees plus of warming *assuming* that we begin taking strong action in 2020. And if the same politics plays out then, well, four degrees plus is looking pretty hard to avoid …

Just reading denier web sites makes me basically accept that we are stuffed. Canberra will be sitting in a desert by 2040.

Agreed DG – we’re fucked.
So watching these puppets play around with “who will lead” the losing party or the loser pary is infuriating. This is like watching the terminally ill fighting over which reality show to watch next on TV.
Who fucking cares??

Ok – rant on…
this is like watching someone who has blown the head gasket on their car having a mechanic change the rear trye – why? because at least he is “Doing Something.”Will it work. No.
Does the client feel better? – possibly. Until the bill comes in and the car is still fucked.
or- like watching someone stand in front of an on-coming tsunami with a wetsuit and floaties saying “at least i am better prepared” – and the guy who sold it to them pissing off with the money ,.
i despair. I truly do .
and so i am getting drunk. Cos- why TF not.

Comments are closed.